This interview deleted after request from interviewee - 6th June 2018
Wednesday, June 15, 2011
Saturday, May 21, 2011
Fruitarian Community..
I've been following an idea for a while, and keep thinking I need to write a blog post about it, so here I am, finally finding time to get around to it..
Some time ago, a friend of ours from here in Australia, a young guy named Sunshine, decided to give fruitarianism a shot. I'm talking of course, of true fruitarianism, a lifestyle that consists of a purely fruit diet.. no nuts, seeds, greens or roots, and we wished him success with his experiment. - His lifestyle choices were fundamentally steered by ethics, and he felt that the time was right, as was the place and decision he'd chosen to follow, so off he trundled out into the world.
He attended the Fruktifest fruitarian gathering that was held in France in 2010. From reports I've heard, it wasn't entirely what I'd expected it to be, but several like-minded people attended, and together a few of them formed the idea of a fruitarian community. Enthused through their meeting and eager to get something started, I think 7 of them journeyed off together to southern Spain where they lived and shared their lives and fruits together for a while.. I believe they were checking out the possibility of purchasing land there, and although I'm not altogether sure of their circumstances and location there, I like to picture them living naked under some fruit trees, swimming in natural water, and enjoying life.
I'm also guessing, (as the truth is I am filling in the gaps with my guesswork), that they were unable to find anything affordable and suitable enough, some likely became restless or, saw this not entirely as they had planned, and decided to move off doing their own things).. What I believe is correct, is that 3 of the small tribe, up and left Europe altogether, together, in the altogether (OK.. OK.. I just made that last bit up about them being in the altogether!).. And ended up in Africa.. - Kenya to be more precise.
Sunshine, Tanya and Pom. (Pom & Tanya both originate from Italy)
Their discoveries, after having already lived there for several months, is that land is abundant, with rich soil, and most assuredly affordable. Land consisting of acres being available for as little as a couple of hundred euros per acre! (compare that to here, where a simple 1 acre prime block of land, with no structure on it, will cost no less than $100,000 (Australian!))..
Anyhow, it seems that the 3 of them, although remaining in close contact, are no longer travelling as a clan, but Sunshine and Tanya are somewhere close to the coast, where there is more of an abundance of available fruit to be had, while Pom has moved inland.. Initially in search of land, but now I gather preparing and planting out on a spot that he is living on, with melons, and other quick growing fruits, in preparation for the others to join him.
Now for the amazing news.. Being in close contact with the native inhabitants, (they built a mud hut dwelling for him to live in!) Pom's lifestyle has rubbed off on them. They have seen him eating just fruit, and questioned his choices. Pom has explained enthusiastically, and the local Kenyans have simply embraced the idea.. He now has I think 17 friends that are proud to call themselves fruitarian, and keen to get more fruit trees planted. They seem to simply love the idea that they can live on just fruit, as it fits in perfectly with their already established religion and belief system.. One local, recently converted guy, Biti is so excited about the idea, he claims that all of his community may turn fruitarian once they hear of it, and that would be about a 1000 people! (apparently they are against schools, establishments, industries, money and consider such things as unavoidable evils.. They don't believe in medicines, like to sing and pray when they plant, and instead of attending any church or such, gather under a tree in nature to praise the Divine. I've heard they also tend to dryfast every couple of weeks for 2 to 4 days!).
One of Poms recently converted Kenyan friends
eating a banana
This is really quite incredible news, as I doubt I myself would have thought of Kenya as being an ideal place to establish a fruitarian community. My misgivings would likely center more around the potential political instability of that part of the world. I have spent a little time in the country though, and do see it's land and people have potential. - back in the beginning of the 80's, my brother was teaching at a school in a little village called Yala in Kenya, and myself, Helena, my sister, and mum & dad all went out to visit him for a few weeks. The experience had quite an impression on me, especially the week long safari seeing all the animals so close.
Apparently due to underlying corruption throughout the officialdom, it is very easy to get ones visa renewed without actually having to leave the country.. (all it takes is a little under the desk bribery, and papers get stamped, no questions asked).
I'm following the project keenly through the website some kind soul has knocked together for Pom: fruitariancommunity.tk. And if anyone wishes to help him out in any fashion, through donation of tropical fruit seed or with desire to join them in Kenya and help advance their efforts, all help would be appreciated, and you can contact him via: wearefruitarian at gmail dot com.
On the confusing side for me though, despite Pom's apparent eagerness to make things happen there, I spoke briefly with Sunshine on the phone several weeks ago. He seemed very uncertain of whether he truly desired to stay in Kenya, and was asking many questions about land availability and affordability back in this corner of the world, and talking also of the possibility of south America. He gave me the impression of being most undecided.
I have no real idea either, of what Tanya's thoughts are on the whole issue.
Several months ago I sent Sunshine an interview and he's still working on that but as he's avoiding computers, progress is slow.. I intend to interview Pom and Tanya too but so far haven't gotten around to organise those [Update: Pom's interview is now online here].. I get the impression with Pom, that he is one of the few people that really seems to get what fruitarianism is about, and there's a part of me that almost wishes I was younger again, and could get out there and join him on his (ad)venture.. But, no I'm feeling settled where we are, and no genuine desires to be anywhere other than here.. sure, would love for the universe to hurry up and miraculously manifest the place we are waiting impatiently for, but I don't see that place as being too far from here..
Anyhow.. Anyone interested in finding out more, I suggest you visit the website and blog (that can be linked to from the website).. I for one am curious to see how this project unfolds and evolves.
Peace,
mango.
Some time ago, a friend of ours from here in Australia, a young guy named Sunshine, decided to give fruitarianism a shot. I'm talking of course, of true fruitarianism, a lifestyle that consists of a purely fruit diet.. no nuts, seeds, greens or roots, and we wished him success with his experiment. - His lifestyle choices were fundamentally steered by ethics, and he felt that the time was right, as was the place and decision he'd chosen to follow, so off he trundled out into the world.
He attended the Fruktifest fruitarian gathering that was held in France in 2010. From reports I've heard, it wasn't entirely what I'd expected it to be, but several like-minded people attended, and together a few of them formed the idea of a fruitarian community. Enthused through their meeting and eager to get something started, I think 7 of them journeyed off together to southern Spain where they lived and shared their lives and fruits together for a while.. I believe they were checking out the possibility of purchasing land there, and although I'm not altogether sure of their circumstances and location there, I like to picture them living naked under some fruit trees, swimming in natural water, and enjoying life.
I'm also guessing, (as the truth is I am filling in the gaps with my guesswork), that they were unable to find anything affordable and suitable enough, some likely became restless or, saw this not entirely as they had planned, and decided to move off doing their own things).. What I believe is correct, is that 3 of the small tribe, up and left Europe altogether, together, in the altogether (OK.. OK.. I just made that last bit up about them being in the altogether!).. And ended up in Africa.. - Kenya to be more precise.
Sunshine, Tanya and Pom. (Pom & Tanya both originate from Italy)
Their discoveries, after having already lived there for several months, is that land is abundant, with rich soil, and most assuredly affordable. Land consisting of acres being available for as little as a couple of hundred euros per acre! (compare that to here, where a simple 1 acre prime block of land, with no structure on it, will cost no less than $100,000 (Australian!))..
Anyhow, it seems that the 3 of them, although remaining in close contact, are no longer travelling as a clan, but Sunshine and Tanya are somewhere close to the coast, where there is more of an abundance of available fruit to be had, while Pom has moved inland.. Initially in search of land, but now I gather preparing and planting out on a spot that he is living on, with melons, and other quick growing fruits, in preparation for the others to join him.
Now for the amazing news.. Being in close contact with the native inhabitants, (they built a mud hut dwelling for him to live in!) Pom's lifestyle has rubbed off on them. They have seen him eating just fruit, and questioned his choices. Pom has explained enthusiastically, and the local Kenyans have simply embraced the idea.. He now has I think 17 friends that are proud to call themselves fruitarian, and keen to get more fruit trees planted. They seem to simply love the idea that they can live on just fruit, as it fits in perfectly with their already established religion and belief system.. One local, recently converted guy, Biti is so excited about the idea, he claims that all of his community may turn fruitarian once they hear of it, and that would be about a 1000 people! (apparently they are against schools, establishments, industries, money and consider such things as unavoidable evils.. They don't believe in medicines, like to sing and pray when they plant, and instead of attending any church or such, gather under a tree in nature to praise the Divine. I've heard they also tend to dryfast every couple of weeks for 2 to 4 days!).
eating a banana
This is really quite incredible news, as I doubt I myself would have thought of Kenya as being an ideal place to establish a fruitarian community. My misgivings would likely center more around the potential political instability of that part of the world. I have spent a little time in the country though, and do see it's land and people have potential. - back in the beginning of the 80's, my brother was teaching at a school in a little village called Yala in Kenya, and myself, Helena, my sister, and mum & dad all went out to visit him for a few weeks. The experience had quite an impression on me, especially the week long safari seeing all the animals so close.
Apparently due to underlying corruption throughout the officialdom, it is very easy to get ones visa renewed without actually having to leave the country.. (all it takes is a little under the desk bribery, and papers get stamped, no questions asked).
I'm following the project keenly through the website some kind soul has knocked together for Pom: fruitariancommunity.tk. And if anyone wishes to help him out in any fashion, through donation of tropical fruit seed or with desire to join them in Kenya and help advance their efforts, all help would be appreciated, and you can contact him via: wearefruitarian at gmail dot com.
On the confusing side for me though, despite Pom's apparent eagerness to make things happen there, I spoke briefly with Sunshine on the phone several weeks ago. He seemed very uncertain of whether he truly desired to stay in Kenya, and was asking many questions about land availability and affordability back in this corner of the world, and talking also of the possibility of south America. He gave me the impression of being most undecided.
I have no real idea either, of what Tanya's thoughts are on the whole issue.
Several months ago I sent Sunshine an interview and he's still working on that but as he's avoiding computers, progress is slow.. I intend to interview Pom and Tanya too but so far haven't gotten around to organise those [Update: Pom's interview is now online here].. I get the impression with Pom, that he is one of the few people that really seems to get what fruitarianism is about, and there's a part of me that almost wishes I was younger again, and could get out there and join him on his (ad)venture.. But, no I'm feeling settled where we are, and no genuine desires to be anywhere other than here.. sure, would love for the universe to hurry up and miraculously manifest the place we are waiting impatiently for, but I don't see that place as being too far from here..
Anyhow.. Anyone interested in finding out more, I suggest you visit the website and blog (that can be linked to from the website).. I for one am curious to see how this project unfolds and evolves.
Peace,
mango.
Tuesday, May 17, 2011
On Grains and green vegetables..
It's been a while since I last post something. I have just not really felt the urge to do so, although at times I have thoughts that filter toward the front of my mind and urge me to put them to paper, I have been neglecting to do so. I don't know, maybe it is some kind of writers block that prevents me from even beginning. Whatever it is, I am not totally happy with it myself, as I enjoy writing, and feel I still have lots that needs to be said.
So where to start now? Well.. I've recently received a fair few emails that have thus far gone unanswered. I'm afraid if you do email me via my website, I may not always find the time to reply, and don't particularly feel that I should be obliged to do so. I prefer if people ask me questions here on my blog, as that way the answers get to be shared with everyone. That's why I try to keep my FAQs page updated, so that people can refer to that first. Like someone recently asked me once more why I don't eat greens.. For sure, I'm likely to go into more detail on that again in a later post, but for the meantime, I suggest you check out the FAQ page, and look at the answer I give there.. anything more specific, you might ask directly on a post that talks specifically about greens..
OK.. Another email question I've received lately I'm going to attempt to answer here:
I am an 18 year old male from London who has had Anorexia Nervosa for 4 years but I'm recovering by myself, and am still struggling to find the right path.
I am a vegan (not raw) transitioning to Fruitarianism as I believe it's the only way to be fully at peace and I'm tired of being dependent on man and not the Earth.
You have really inspired me and I am fascinated by you... Even you're view that it's only 'you who can decide what and when to eat' makes so much sense as opposed to these other RV sites which promote gluttony even on a healthy/natural die. - The 30BaD website helped me, but deep down I knew that forcing myself to eat such large quantities was unnecessary, I really need a balance and not one of over indulging without any true reason that makes sense, if you know what I mean.
Surely this is not at all spiritually different from a Omnivorous diet as it is still calculating etc and is artificial.. You on the other hand go with natural cues, which is why you're so amazing...
I am living off grains and green vegetables currently and seem very calm and comfortable. However, is this ok? I really want to find peace, and you seem to have done that....
I'm not a bad person for consuming grains am I? And I was glad to see your comment that 'noone knows better than yourself' as this really woke me up from my daydream of relying on other peoples routine!
OK.. Firstly I wish to make it abundantly clear that I don't give dietary advice. I basically blatantly state my opinion, which human as we ALL are, I'm aware could ultimately be wrong. This world has too many people in it that are unwilling to take responsibility for their own actions and choices, and I know that cosmically speaking, I am ultimately only really responsible for my own thoughts, choices and actions. And I know the same goes for everyone else, much as when things go wrong they are only too eager to point the finger elsewhere.
But having said that, I shall now state my opinion. Yes, I believe that force feeding oneself, more than the body desires, makes little sense to me, and therefore I cannot accept that a decision to do so is based on any real wisdom. (sure, people will think the same about my choice to eat purely fruit, but well, let them, I say!). I cannot claim to have any in depth experience and knowledge of anorexia specifically, but I do believe that it is just one of a multitude of disorders that prevail throughout the world. The vast majority of people out there have never been truly educated to what constitutes real food, eating all manner of highly addictive foodstuffs which can lead to countless nutritional problems. So I try to maintain a simplistic approach to it all, and view all problems as fundamentally the same, with the same principle underlying causes, and basically the same solution. Sure, you could come up with rare examples that apparently don't fit this pattern, but go back far enough and be observant enough, and I believe that even those cases can be seen to have the basic same origins. IE, not everything can be fixed through the duration of one single lifetime. But certainly improved though!
You question of whether the overindulging of even comparatively good foods can be spiritually any different to that of the standard omnivorous diet. I personally wonder why such a question arises.. I see the 2 as very different, for the basic Low Fat Raw Vegan diet to which you refer, has already made great spiritual progress through avoiding the consumption of animal products and cooked foods, sure they may be still stuck in their rut of classifying foods as carbohydrates, fats and omegas, and bent on counting calories, but for them, they feel a need to be comforted by such, it is not a bad thing, although I do believe fear-based - like they may feel that if they don't do so, they can get their balances wrong, and end up suffering from it. They just do not trust their own bodies yet, and have been mesmerized by the hypnotic numbers quoted by nutritional pseudo-scientists. Hence the overeating too, they feel they need to do that. Depriving them of that will help noone.. Some of them will eventually evolve beyond such a need, but that'll be an individual thing. I hold no attachment to any of it, and wish them all well.
You ask if you are a bad person for consuming grains.. Well, no, that wouldn't be nice of me! I mean, who would I be to judge anyone as bad. That's not for any of us to do. Now I can judge actions as bad, and/or misguided, and I do believe that eating grains is misguided. And my judgements may or may not be correct. That's the way the world is, we have to all make up our own minds about what we truly think is right or not. If you want to perhaps get more of an insight into why I believe grain eating is folly, then imagine yourself growing and harvesting your own grain. Seriously, you don't have to actually go out and do that, just use your imagination. No machinery.. Just picture the work and effort that would be required.. How will you stop weeds growing between the grain? you can't weed without trampling all over it.. How much land do you think you will need to produce grain enough for one loaf of bread? How will you harvest it? Now picture yourself with an apple tree.. sure you may have to wait 8 years for one to grow and give fruit, but meanwhile there are an abundance of other ones around. There is tremendous work effort put into growing rice and every other grain, a good deal of which originates from hardworking underpaid manual workers in underdeveloped countries that have trouble feeding themselves. Their land is very often highly suitable for fruit tree growing which is far more profitable.. Grain is for the birds, out in nature, you could never gather enough to have a serious feed.
Green vegetables are a different story, and can be easily grown in ones own backyard, but the longer you are on a raw vegan diet, I believe you will naturally veer toward increasingly higher percentages of fruit. Especially when available. - Remember demand increases supply!
So, is it OK to be living on greens and grains? well.. it's all relative really.. You could be doing far far worse.. But there's always room for improvement too. That's the beauty of life, perfection may be an unattainable goal but that shouldn't stop you enjoying trying to reach it.
I wish you success on your path, and wisdom in your decision making.
Peace to you all!
So where to start now? Well.. I've recently received a fair few emails that have thus far gone unanswered. I'm afraid if you do email me via my website, I may not always find the time to reply, and don't particularly feel that I should be obliged to do so. I prefer if people ask me questions here on my blog, as that way the answers get to be shared with everyone. That's why I try to keep my FAQs page updated, so that people can refer to that first. Like someone recently asked me once more why I don't eat greens.. For sure, I'm likely to go into more detail on that again in a later post, but for the meantime, I suggest you check out the FAQ page, and look at the answer I give there.. anything more specific, you might ask directly on a post that talks specifically about greens..
OK.. Another email question I've received lately I'm going to attempt to answer here:
I am an 18 year old male from London who has had Anorexia Nervosa for 4 years but I'm recovering by myself, and am still struggling to find the right path.
I am a vegan (not raw) transitioning to Fruitarianism as I believe it's the only way to be fully at peace and I'm tired of being dependent on man and not the Earth.
You have really inspired me and I am fascinated by you... Even you're view that it's only 'you who can decide what and when to eat' makes so much sense as opposed to these other RV sites which promote gluttony even on a healthy/natural die. - The 30BaD website helped me, but deep down I knew that forcing myself to eat such large quantities was unnecessary, I really need a balance and not one of over indulging without any true reason that makes sense, if you know what I mean.
Surely this is not at all spiritually different from a Omnivorous diet as it is still calculating etc and is artificial.. You on the other hand go with natural cues, which is why you're so amazing...
I am living off grains and green vegetables currently and seem very calm and comfortable. However, is this ok? I really want to find peace, and you seem to have done that....
I'm not a bad person for consuming grains am I? And I was glad to see your comment that 'noone knows better than yourself' as this really woke me up from my daydream of relying on other peoples routine!
OK.. Firstly I wish to make it abundantly clear that I don't give dietary advice. I basically blatantly state my opinion, which human as we ALL are, I'm aware could ultimately be wrong. This world has too many people in it that are unwilling to take responsibility for their own actions and choices, and I know that cosmically speaking, I am ultimately only really responsible for my own thoughts, choices and actions. And I know the same goes for everyone else, much as when things go wrong they are only too eager to point the finger elsewhere.
But having said that, I shall now state my opinion. Yes, I believe that force feeding oneself, more than the body desires, makes little sense to me, and therefore I cannot accept that a decision to do so is based on any real wisdom. (sure, people will think the same about my choice to eat purely fruit, but well, let them, I say!). I cannot claim to have any in depth experience and knowledge of anorexia specifically, but I do believe that it is just one of a multitude of disorders that prevail throughout the world. The vast majority of people out there have never been truly educated to what constitutes real food, eating all manner of highly addictive foodstuffs which can lead to countless nutritional problems. So I try to maintain a simplistic approach to it all, and view all problems as fundamentally the same, with the same principle underlying causes, and basically the same solution. Sure, you could come up with rare examples that apparently don't fit this pattern, but go back far enough and be observant enough, and I believe that even those cases can be seen to have the basic same origins. IE, not everything can be fixed through the duration of one single lifetime. But certainly improved though!
You question of whether the overindulging of even comparatively good foods can be spiritually any different to that of the standard omnivorous diet. I personally wonder why such a question arises.. I see the 2 as very different, for the basic Low Fat Raw Vegan diet to which you refer, has already made great spiritual progress through avoiding the consumption of animal products and cooked foods, sure they may be still stuck in their rut of classifying foods as carbohydrates, fats and omegas, and bent on counting calories, but for them, they feel a need to be comforted by such, it is not a bad thing, although I do believe fear-based - like they may feel that if they don't do so, they can get their balances wrong, and end up suffering from it. They just do not trust their own bodies yet, and have been mesmerized by the hypnotic numbers quoted by nutritional pseudo-scientists. Hence the overeating too, they feel they need to do that. Depriving them of that will help noone.. Some of them will eventually evolve beyond such a need, but that'll be an individual thing. I hold no attachment to any of it, and wish them all well.
You ask if you are a bad person for consuming grains.. Well, no, that wouldn't be nice of me! I mean, who would I be to judge anyone as bad. That's not for any of us to do. Now I can judge actions as bad, and/or misguided, and I do believe that eating grains is misguided. And my judgements may or may not be correct. That's the way the world is, we have to all make up our own minds about what we truly think is right or not. If you want to perhaps get more of an insight into why I believe grain eating is folly, then imagine yourself growing and harvesting your own grain. Seriously, you don't have to actually go out and do that, just use your imagination. No machinery.. Just picture the work and effort that would be required.. How will you stop weeds growing between the grain? you can't weed without trampling all over it.. How much land do you think you will need to produce grain enough for one loaf of bread? How will you harvest it? Now picture yourself with an apple tree.. sure you may have to wait 8 years for one to grow and give fruit, but meanwhile there are an abundance of other ones around. There is tremendous work effort put into growing rice and every other grain, a good deal of which originates from hardworking underpaid manual workers in underdeveloped countries that have trouble feeding themselves. Their land is very often highly suitable for fruit tree growing which is far more profitable.. Grain is for the birds, out in nature, you could never gather enough to have a serious feed.
Green vegetables are a different story, and can be easily grown in ones own backyard, but the longer you are on a raw vegan diet, I believe you will naturally veer toward increasingly higher percentages of fruit. Especially when available. - Remember demand increases supply!
So, is it OK to be living on greens and grains? well.. it's all relative really.. You could be doing far far worse.. But there's always room for improvement too. That's the beauty of life, perfection may be an unattainable goal but that shouldn't stop you enjoying trying to reach it.
I wish you success on your path, and wisdom in your decision making.
Peace to you all!
Monday, April 18, 2011
Low Fat Raw Vegan vs Paleo.. The debate
Well folks, the debate took place on Friday the 15th April, our time, (down under), and I believe Kveta and I were one of the 1000 plus that listened in to the event live.
It was sort of entertaining, but I must admit it left me a little frustrated.
In his closing statement, Richard (the cooked flesh eater), claimed that Harley (the calorie counting vegan) was more debating against general omnivores than Paleo specific, but to be honest, Richard was doing exactly the same, debating more against veganism than Harleys more specific version of low fat, and raw.
Neither party really went overboard loosing their cool at any time, which admittedly surprised me with Richard, as when I briefly attempted a discussion with him over at his blog, his responses (and those of the bulk of the rest of his disciples) were generally quite primitive in nature, and consisted of a fair bit of name calling.
Richard gave a bit of an odd response to the question about whether he at all felt any moral qualms about his chosen diet, stating something about the rights for humans not coming from the fact that we can feel pain and suffer like animals, but rather that we can think. As if animals are themselves incapable of such, or as if every human is capable of such. Clearly neither is true.
He also very much showed his ignorance by stating his view that a vegan based lifestyle would destroy the earth and kill off animals by destroying their habitat. He clearly has neither an idea how much land is lost due to livestock farming, nor how much more environmentally sound an agriculture based predominantly around fruit tree growing has the potential to be. Perhaps he is comparing more a nomadic based lifestyle, of hunters and gatherers living in small tribes, something likely far afield from his own lifestyle choice.
The point was also made about Harley being too skinny in the eyes of a Paleo, but when Harley countered that his body weight and size was comparable to most other endurance athletes, Richard fully dismissed this, saying that his athletic prowess had nothing to do with the debate at hand.
Then there was that whole comparison he made of liver versus a bowl of fruit.. I mean yuck, who cares how much nutrient is in either (!).. one is dead and unappealingly disgusting, the other is vibrant, colourful and sweet..
Harley handled himself pretty well, but I do know that he has a tendency to exaggerate the truth at times. Not about his athletic fetes, I don't doubt those for a second, but he does state that he shares a flat with a paleo flat mate, and if it's the guy I believe it to be, then I don't think it's quite factual to be labeling him as paleo.
He also brought up the old adage about sticking a rabbit and a piece of fruit in with a baby and see which one it eats.. I used to like that one, but honestly, if you think about it, most omnivore parents would not give their babies living animals to kill themselves. They would kill and rip it open first. I would guess that an innocent baby would want to stick both items (the apple and the flesh) in their mouths, as that's how babies find out about the world.
Sure though, I will merit that the vast majority of humans don't have the heart to take a knife to a cows throat and kill it for lunch.
A little too much talk of triglycerines and the B12 critters (whatever they are) and their ilk for my liking, but I guess for many that's what they want to hear.
When Richard claimed that "the china study" had been debunked, Harley countered that, yes, by a 21 year old girl who he doubted the existence of. Personally I thought this a pretty weak response.. I mean, it's not that I myself have read the China study, nor have any great desire or intention to do so, nor have I seen the debunking response, but dismissing a debunk purely on the supposed age and gender of the debunker is a little unfair. (it may well be the debunk is weak by it's own merits, but if the author is genuinely a mystery, it may also be there was far more research put into it than Harley is aware).
And, this has little to do with his side of the debate, and is more about me wanting to be that small voice for fruitarianism, he also made that statement about not knowing anyone that eats just fruit (he knows Kveta and myself at least). But I guess he is entitled to believe that those of us that claim we do, are all liars, though I can't help but think still that Harley somehow feels threatened by the idea.. Also, I am quite curious to know where he get's his data from when he states so matter of factly that Ross Horne was not vegan.
Anyhow, Kudos to both parties for stepping up to the microphone and airing their view points. If you want to listen to it, here it is:
Listen to Harley vs Richard -
DurianRider vs the Animal Debate
Or if you want your own copy of the debate, then you can order one here:
http://realhealthdebate.com/sales/
hugs,
Mango
It was sort of entertaining, but I must admit it left me a little frustrated.
In his closing statement, Richard (the cooked flesh eater), claimed that Harley (the calorie counting vegan) was more debating against general omnivores than Paleo specific, but to be honest, Richard was doing exactly the same, debating more against veganism than Harleys more specific version of low fat, and raw.
Neither party really went overboard loosing their cool at any time, which admittedly surprised me with Richard, as when I briefly attempted a discussion with him over at his blog, his responses (and those of the bulk of the rest of his disciples) were generally quite primitive in nature, and consisted of a fair bit of name calling.
Richard gave a bit of an odd response to the question about whether he at all felt any moral qualms about his chosen diet, stating something about the rights for humans not coming from the fact that we can feel pain and suffer like animals, but rather that we can think. As if animals are themselves incapable of such, or as if every human is capable of such. Clearly neither is true.
He also very much showed his ignorance by stating his view that a vegan based lifestyle would destroy the earth and kill off animals by destroying their habitat. He clearly has neither an idea how much land is lost due to livestock farming, nor how much more environmentally sound an agriculture based predominantly around fruit tree growing has the potential to be. Perhaps he is comparing more a nomadic based lifestyle, of hunters and gatherers living in small tribes, something likely far afield from his own lifestyle choice.
The point was also made about Harley being too skinny in the eyes of a Paleo, but when Harley countered that his body weight and size was comparable to most other endurance athletes, Richard fully dismissed this, saying that his athletic prowess had nothing to do with the debate at hand.
Then there was that whole comparison he made of liver versus a bowl of fruit.. I mean yuck, who cares how much nutrient is in either (!).. one is dead and unappealingly disgusting, the other is vibrant, colourful and sweet..
Harley handled himself pretty well, but I do know that he has a tendency to exaggerate the truth at times. Not about his athletic fetes, I don't doubt those for a second, but he does state that he shares a flat with a paleo flat mate, and if it's the guy I believe it to be, then I don't think it's quite factual to be labeling him as paleo.
He also brought up the old adage about sticking a rabbit and a piece of fruit in with a baby and see which one it eats.. I used to like that one, but honestly, if you think about it, most omnivore parents would not give their babies living animals to kill themselves. They would kill and rip it open first. I would guess that an innocent baby would want to stick both items (the apple and the flesh) in their mouths, as that's how babies find out about the world.
Sure though, I will merit that the vast majority of humans don't have the heart to take a knife to a cows throat and kill it for lunch.
A little too much talk of triglycerines and the B12 critters (whatever they are) and their ilk for my liking, but I guess for many that's what they want to hear.
When Richard claimed that "the china study" had been debunked, Harley countered that, yes, by a 21 year old girl who he doubted the existence of. Personally I thought this a pretty weak response.. I mean, it's not that I myself have read the China study, nor have any great desire or intention to do so, nor have I seen the debunking response, but dismissing a debunk purely on the supposed age and gender of the debunker is a little unfair. (it may well be the debunk is weak by it's own merits, but if the author is genuinely a mystery, it may also be there was far more research put into it than Harley is aware).
And, this has little to do with his side of the debate, and is more about me wanting to be that small voice for fruitarianism, he also made that statement about not knowing anyone that eats just fruit (he knows Kveta and myself at least). But I guess he is entitled to believe that those of us that claim we do, are all liars, though I can't help but think still that Harley somehow feels threatened by the idea.. Also, I am quite curious to know where he get's his data from when he states so matter of factly that Ross Horne was not vegan.
Anyhow, Kudos to both parties for stepping up to the microphone and airing their view points. If you want to listen to it, here it is:
Listen to Harley vs Richard -
DurianRider vs the Animal Debate
Or if you want your own copy of the debate, then you can order one here:
http://realhealthdebate.com/sales/
hugs,
Mango
Friday, April 15, 2011
Crazy World News - 13 - Eggs soaked in piss.
The truth, we're told, is often stranger than fiction, and this is surely one of those cases. Apparently, A certain chinese province is going wild about the latest delicatessen, - schoolboy urine soaked eggs!
Dongyang people boil eggs in boy’s urine and sell them for 1.50 yuan (just over 20 US cents each). They're said to be selling like hot cakes!
Now for me, eating birds eggs is pretty bizarre enough itself, boiling them adds to the chaos, and doing so with urine, and being allowed to simmer all day(!).. well, that's just the icing on the sugar of madness.
In 2008, these tong zi dan (Boy eggs), were listed by the city of Dongyong as a local intangible cultural heritage.
See: Boys Urine Soaked Eggs Listed as Local Specialty
Crikey.. Actually, on a similar note, I recall watching "An Idiot Abroad" (an excellent TV documentary series well worth watching), a guy named Karl Pilkington who travels to see the 7 wonders of the world, one of them being the great wall of china. Anyhow, he gives his view on the chinese way of eating, which to be sure is not much more bizarre than his own, just different.. See this video about 2 minutes in, where they show yet another way eggs are eaten in that part of the world..
And if you found that bizarrely fascinating, have a look at this one:
Dongyang people boil eggs in boy’s urine and sell them for 1.50 yuan (just over 20 US cents each). They're said to be selling like hot cakes!
Now for me, eating birds eggs is pretty bizarre enough itself, boiling them adds to the chaos, and doing so with urine, and being allowed to simmer all day(!).. well, that's just the icing on the sugar of madness.
In 2008, these tong zi dan (Boy eggs), were listed by the city of Dongyong as a local intangible cultural heritage.
See: Boys Urine Soaked Eggs Listed as Local Specialty
Crikey.. Actually, on a similar note, I recall watching "An Idiot Abroad" (an excellent TV documentary series well worth watching), a guy named Karl Pilkington who travels to see the 7 wonders of the world, one of them being the great wall of china. Anyhow, he gives his view on the chinese way of eating, which to be sure is not much more bizarre than his own, just different.. See this video about 2 minutes in, where they show yet another way eggs are eaten in that part of the world..
And if you found that bizarrely fascinating, have a look at this one:
Tuesday, April 12, 2011
Guy builds his own island out of plastic bottles.
I recently stumbled onto this bit of interesting news, not exactly fruitarian in nature, but certainly innovative and inspiring.. It's about a British guy, ex-pat, named Rishi Sowa, living in Mexico, off the coast of an island called "Las Mujeres". He's built himself a small tropical paradise from recycled materials, predominantly discarded plastic drinking bottles.
According to this youtube video, the claims are, that he is totally self sufficient on an island no bigger than the size of a tennis court.. Growing his own small vegetable garden with pawpaw, tomatoes, spinach, cocounuts, cucumbers etc..
It's not mentioned in the video, but my guess is it's highly likely he is fishing too.. .
His island is a work in progress, and grows steadily each day as he is forever in search of additional discarded bottles too expand his home. It uses alternative energy sources to power the small electrical devices he uses, and he's even designed his own washing machine that works solely on the constant wave motion around the island.
This is how his island currently looks:
It's difficult to imagine the work he must have put in getting it just to the stage it is at.. fetching sand from the beaches to create a more island looking base to his home, and growing mangroves along the edge to stop sand errosion.. Actually, that's one of the aspects that puzzles me most about this project, - how does he stop the sea constantly stealing back the sand from his beaches?..
His plan is to one day, when he feels the island is ready, to raise the anchors and push out into the ocean becoming his own independent country. Though it seems difficult for me to imagine that the island will ever be sturdy enough to withstand heavy seas, (apparently this is his 2nd attempt as the original island was destroyed by a hurricane!), from what he's managed to accomplish so far, provided the Mexicans don't commandeer his little makeshift paradise, my guess is it seems likely he will achieve his goal.
To find out more, visit his website:
Spiralislanders.info
According to this youtube video, the claims are, that he is totally self sufficient on an island no bigger than the size of a tennis court.. Growing his own small vegetable garden with pawpaw, tomatoes, spinach, cocounuts, cucumbers etc..
It's not mentioned in the video, but my guess is it's highly likely he is fishing too.. .
His island is a work in progress, and grows steadily each day as he is forever in search of additional discarded bottles too expand his home. It uses alternative energy sources to power the small electrical devices he uses, and he's even designed his own washing machine that works solely on the constant wave motion around the island.
This is how his island currently looks:
It's difficult to imagine the work he must have put in getting it just to the stage it is at.. fetching sand from the beaches to create a more island looking base to his home, and growing mangroves along the edge to stop sand errosion.. Actually, that's one of the aspects that puzzles me most about this project, - how does he stop the sea constantly stealing back the sand from his beaches?..
His plan is to one day, when he feels the island is ready, to raise the anchors and push out into the ocean becoming his own independent country. Though it seems difficult for me to imagine that the island will ever be sturdy enough to withstand heavy seas, (apparently this is his 2nd attempt as the original island was destroyed by a hurricane!), from what he's managed to accomplish so far, provided the Mexicans don't commandeer his little makeshift paradise, my guess is it seems likely he will achieve his goal.
To find out more, visit his website:
Spiralislanders.info
Saturday, April 09, 2011
Harley Vs Richard.
Well folks, I've mentioned this briefly earlier, but without making too big a fuss of it, as at the time, no date had been fixed in stone..
But that's just changed! A time-slot has been allocated, and both parties seem keen to come head to head..
THE DEBATE
In the green corner we have Durianrider Harley, who is taking the low fat raw vegan glycogen calorie obsessed 80/10/10 stance. And in the dripping blood red corner, Neanderthal Richard Nikoley, the high fat cooked zombie flesh eating paleo stance. Both parties are no doubt already firmly entrenched in their ways, and I seriously doubt either would be at all open to change their stance, so the debate will not be about convincing themselves or each other, but hopefully should be of some benefit to others who have yet to fully decide their paths.
The debate can be viewed live (just visit realhealthdebate.com, watch the intro video, and sign up to receive a link to the event). It'll be structured, with limited times allocated to each party, with both stating their cases, and both having time following to ask and answer each other questions.
It'll take place at 6pm PST on the 14th April (which works out to midday on the 15th here on the east coast of Australia).
I was reading up on Richards Blog, and he seems pretty confident, as do most of the comments from his followers who admittedly, are not the sharpest tools in the box. No doubt similar confidence is being expressed over at 30 bananas a day..
If nothing else, I'm sure the debate will prove itself entertaining. Enjoy
But that's just changed! A time-slot has been allocated, and both parties seem keen to come head to head..
THE DEBATE
In the green corner we have Durianrider Harley, who is taking the low fat raw vegan glycogen calorie obsessed 80/10/10 stance. And in the dripping blood red corner, Neanderthal Richard Nikoley, the high fat cooked zombie flesh eating paleo stance. Both parties are no doubt already firmly entrenched in their ways, and I seriously doubt either would be at all open to change their stance, so the debate will not be about convincing themselves or each other, but hopefully should be of some benefit to others who have yet to fully decide their paths.
The debate can be viewed live (just visit realhealthdebate.com, watch the intro video, and sign up to receive a link to the event). It'll be structured, with limited times allocated to each party, with both stating their cases, and both having time following to ask and answer each other questions.
It'll take place at 6pm PST on the 14th April (which works out to midday on the 15th here on the east coast of Australia).
I was reading up on Richards Blog, and he seems pretty confident, as do most of the comments from his followers who admittedly, are not the sharpest tools in the box. No doubt similar confidence is being expressed over at 30 bananas a day..
If nothing else, I'm sure the debate will prove itself entertaining. Enjoy
Subscribe to:
Posts (Atom)